Navigating Awkward Conversations - Unveiling the Pitfalls of Clichés and Finding True Dialogue

Safety Net Conversations – How They Can Be Harmful to Friendships - TRANSCRIPT
[00:00:00] Fawn: Oh, thank you. Thank you. Hi, everybody. Welcome back. Yay. Welcome back. Thank you for listening. Yes. Seriously. Thank you. Love all of you so much. We love you so much. Every day my eyes are opening more and more. And I want to say I'm becoming more and more like not social. Is that weird? Lately I've been needing time alone because I'm way more sensitive than I ever have been at the same time.
[00:00:30] Fawn: I'm more open than ever. 
[00:00:32] MATT: That seems backwards.
[00:00:33] Fawn: I know it doesn't make sense, but such is the state of the world. Nothing makes sense. Anyway, I was just hard on myself thinking, thank you for your service. I wish I wouldn't have said that. Okay. So this is what happened. You guys yesterday, we went to a 
[00:00:50] Fawn: museum and I don't like antique shops.
[00:00:55] Fawn: And I don't like most museums, as most of you know about me. This was a different kind of museum, this was a museum that had old-timey stuff in it. So both things that don't agree with me, antiques and museums together, right? I was so freaked out every turn of this museum, from weird looking, Egyptian looking American coffins to Axes to weird looking dolls to everything was frightful.
[00:01:26] Fawn: It's ironic because last week we were talking about horror movies. I swear, you guys seem to be having an okay time. But every turn inside my body I was like, Ah! Woo! Ah! I was like screaming to myself. Right. Ah! Anyway, but I, um, we went upstairs and we got into this one room and all of a sudden I was so excited because A, there were not that many people up there, B, the lighting was really nice, and then C, it was just a big room without any walls, nice hardwood floor.
[00:02:04] Fawn: And it had photography stuff everywhere like photography equipment, right? So I think I was like, I didn't even realize it but I'm like, why do I feel much better up here? Let me just I'm just gonna stand. Well, the lighting certainly was way better. Well, I saw this really cool table I'm like, oh Matt, come here.
[00:02:21] Fawn: I'm like Tracy. Come here. You guys look at this table And it was a table one of those long big beautiful tables that could work in a modern farmhouse kitchen , and it was at a perfect height for me, so I could roll out dough, just lots of space. And, it's the, I love, I love having an actual working office desk.
[00:02:46] Fawn: It's the first time in my life I've actually had an open office desk. As opposed to like a hutch that's meant for linens that I would open up and things would roll out and I would have, that would be my office. Because we always lived. And still do, in such a small area of space, right? So we had a live work space.
[00:03:04] Fawn: Right. So, Anyway, so I was in this room, feeling better, so I was starting to get more talkative. Mm hmm. There weren't that many people there, but everyone else kind of left. I was standing there looking at this wall. And it was an article, it was huge and with pictures, but it was an article about all these hurricanes that hit that specific area that we were in.
[00:03:24] Fawn: It described how a certain amount of inches of rain fell, wiped out the town. Then two days later, a bigger hurricane came, wiped out again. Like over and over again. And we're staring at the pictures. And I'm standing next to this man, who is older, I don't know, I never try to guess people's ages.
[00:03:44] Fawn: I don't. Because we, you and I are always saying we're not an age, we're an energy. And we always stay away from people and situations where age comes up. Because immediately with an age associated with disease, what, this is what's going to happen. 
[00:04:00] MATT: And just bias in general. Ugh. You're either too young or too 
[00:04:03] Fawn: old.
[00:04:04] Fawn: It's just, we stay away from all of that. So we stay just pure, like who we are. And we're not dictated by what society thinks we should be doing or not be doing at whatever number they think is appropriate to do whatever. Anyway. So I don't know how old this guy was. He looked very, in shape, and like, cool.
[00:04:28] Fawn: Like there was a vibe about him that I was digging, and I was, and you know me, like I can't even stand near someone, but I, I felt myself copacetic in that situation. I was like a few inches away from him. We were both looking at the same pictures. And all of a sudden I start talking, I'm like, Oh, Fawn, what are you saying?
[00:04:47] Fawn: Oh my God. What comes out of my mouth is something like this. I really don't remember what I was saying, but it felt poetic as I was saying it. I don't know if I were to relive it, maybe I sounded like a total fool speaking gibberish. But what I was saying was something like, look at how kind nature is to us.
[00:05:08] Fawn: Meanwhile, we were looking at devastation from the aftermath of a hurricane, hurricane after hurricane. And he's like, what? 
[00:05:19] MATT: Of course. 
[00:05:23] Fawn: I said, isn't it amazing how gracious nature is? It's really kind. Because look at that. A few inches of rain can devastate people. And what we've built. So, with just a little tiny movement of nature's pinky finger, she can wipe everything off.
[00:05:45] Fawn: Right. Right? 
[00:05:46] MATT: Well, yeah, earthquake, you name it. 
[00:05:49] Fawn: Well, just barely, but nature has been so good to us. Meanwhile, we have been completely destructive to her, to it, you know? Mm hmm. To all sentient beings, which I think the earth is. And so, so we started a dialogue and then he's like, you know, I remember that.
[00:06:09] Fawn: So whatever it was, was like in 1955, I think. And we were talking and he's like, yeah, I wasn't in this town, but I was a town over and I was, 15 years old. And then he started talking about, yeah, I served in the war, and then I became so nervous because he was talking to me. I was in awe of him. I was so impressed by him, energetically, that I got really nervous.
[00:06:41] Fawn: And when I get nervous, I freeze. So because we were looking in numbers, 1955, he gave me numbers. He was 15 at 1955 and then he was in a war. And then, then I started blanking out on my math. Like I couldn't add or subtract. I was just stuck because I was energetically overwhelmed. And so, and so. I was thinking to myself, did he fight in World War II?
[00:07:10] Fawn: Oh my God. And I'm like, no it couldn't have been because we're looking at 1955. But it didn't, it didn't click. I was like, I don't know what war he's talking about. And then because I got nervous, what comes out of my mouth, because we were starting a really deep, pure conversation. So here, so what comes out of my mouth is, thank you for your service.
[00:07:31] Fawn: And then immediately as I said it, I wanted to throw up. Because that's not what I wanted to say. What I really wanted to say was, I'm sorry. I'm so sorry. That you had to be in a war. I wanted to ask him his perspective of the situation in our, the whole state of everything in our society, how we behave, how we don't make collective sacrifices for the collective, do you know what I'm saying?
[00:07:56] Fawn: It's all a me, me, me, individualistic, like, I'm gonna do this, I'm gonna do that. And I'm not gonna be inconvenienced, you know what I'm saying? Yes. Whereas the people who fought in World War II, my goodness. Talk about selfless, talk about like, 
[00:08:12] MATT: not thinking. Well yeah, they describe whole towns volunteering at once.
[00:08:17] MATT: Like, whole high school classes just going down to the draft office. 
[00:08:22] Fawn: I mean, just everything, you know, everything. Sacrificing what you ate. What you couldn't eat. Right. Uh, women not wearing pantyhose. To, to have The, the 
[00:08:34] MATT: coins being made out of steel, I mean, it was just constantly Across the board. Impressed on you that things were, things were interesting and ta Um, you know.
[00:08:43] MATT: So 
[00:08:45] Fawn: what, what, what I want to talk about today is what do we do with opportunities where we could have the potential of having pure and meaningful dialogue, but we end up out of insecurity saying some messed up trope or a cliched response instead to something. How can we, how can we fight that?
[00:09:09] Fawn: Like, I can't believe that happened to me. Cause I usually don't care. I don't care. But the math came in on top of it, I was gone. I was like, Oh man, I can't do the math right now. Cause I was seriously like impressed by this man. And then as soon as I said that the whole thing fell apart and he smiled very like
[00:09:29] Fawn: awkwardly, and he left. There, there. Bye bye. Oh, man. I was so sad, because I wanted to get to know him. Like, what was your story, man? What is your story? Because he felt I don't know. He felt unworldly. Like, out of this world. Timeless. Very together. Like, someone you want to hear from. Like, please tell me your opinion.
[00:09:55] Fawn: You know? Yes. So anyway, what do you have to say? 
[00:10:00] MATT: Yeah, it's like, I call them almost safety net conversations. These little tiny things you can throw out there, which experience has shown you are safe. Safe. Because we, I think as a society, are so afraid of looking foolish that we go to absurd lengths to avoid it.
[00:10:24] MATT: And, you know, my own moment was, my boss at one job, he was acting in a play. But, oh, Matt didn't want to say break a leg. Oh no, that's the cliche thing to say. So I went the other direction. I was like, I should say something like break a leg, but not break a leg to wish him good luck on your performance, because there's a superstition that says if you wish someone good luck, they won't have good luck.
[00:10:50] MATT: So that's hence break a leg is. Yeah. So I said, I don't even remember what I said. It was that embarrassing, but I was like, I hope you get blah, blah. I don't even know. 
[00:11:02] Fawn: I hope you get 
[00:11:03] MATT: scurmy. And then I was just like, Whoa, you are never doing that again. I am going to stick to the safety net conversation for those types of things.
[00:11:16] Fawn: You know, and I think that comes from not understanding. So, for example, I don't think I know, I don't know why we say break a leg. Do you have to say the, is it like knocking on wood? Like, do you have to say the opposite? So, the opposite happens of that? 
[00:11:31] MATT: It's, yes, it's superstitious to wish someone good luck who's about 
[00:11:35] Fawn: to go perform.
[00:11:36] Fawn: So, therefore, you can't say, I really hope the audience, vibes with you and you change people's lives. Right. You can't even say that. It's bad luck. So I would say let's not do or say anything. Well, but then you're not 
[00:11:49] MATT: wishing them 
[00:11:49] Fawn: anything. You can look at them and smile. I don't know. I really don't know because I'm like, well, what if you take them flowers, but who knows?
[00:11:58] Fawn: Maybe that's also like a taboo. Flowers 
[00:12:00] MATT: after the performance, not during, not before. Yeah, I know. It's, it's, it's tricky. And it's, it's almost like 
[00:12:07] Fawn: Can you say, I believe in you? You're amazing. I don't know. See, who cares, honestly? But then, yeah, if you don't know the culture, and you say something that comes from your heart, you don't know that that culture doesn't Doesn't vibe with that.
[00:12:26] Fawn: Doesn't vibe with that. That could mess them up. 
[00:12:29] MATT: Right. And it could have messed up the, uh, the veteran that you spoke to the other day. I don't know. But I certainly know that, that one time going from the, from the heart, what I thought was from the heart, oh man. If I could take that one back, that's one I would very much like to take back.
[00:12:45] Fawn: So what do we do? Break a leg. No, you know, you know, you and I totally believe to the hardcore level of how words have power right to the point where We won't eat something that has a bad word on it Sorry Dave's killer bread we've never you know, no, no, thank you. Sorry Pete's wicked ale Wicked yeah, right if a chocolate cake says chocolate to die for no, thank you you and I are very careful with words.
[00:13:22] Fawn: So, like, I was training with someone a couple months ago. I think I'd already told you guys a few months ago. And he's a well known voice actor. And then I had a Zoom meeting with him and he had a busted lip. I mean, he looked really messed up. He was doing yard work, and some machine he was using went out of control, and it hit him.
[00:13:44] Fawn: Mm hmm. He had a busted lip. Because in the voiceover world, you say, break a lip. Ooh. Right? So he broke his lip. Yeah, he's like, for real. Like Nice. So I would say, in that instance, it's best to be quiet, maybe talk about something else. 
[00:14:06] MATT: But then you feel like you're ignoring that part of 
[00:14:08] Fawn: things? No, because you're there for the performance.
[00:14:10] Fawn: I mean, why are we stuck on a play right now? But, mm. Thank you for your service. No, I'm not. I I don't, I I'm telling you, I don't know why, but I felt so wrong saying that. I, I just, I want to immediately vomit. Yeah. So the, 
[00:14:25] MATT: I was in, I was in the exact same boat. 
[00:14:28] Fawn: Yeah, but that's what people say is thank you for your service.
[00:14:31] Fawn: I know. And I even did a bow. I bowed to him. I'm like, what am I doing? Like, what? I just felt like a buffoon because I didn't know what to say. 
[00:14:40] MATT: Right, well on some level you also kind of almost reduced him to a one dimensional figure. 
[00:14:47] Fawn: Thanks, honey. Yeah, I didn't feel bad enough. Yeah, you're right. I did. I did.
[00:14:54] Fawn: What? Well now I feel bad. No. Okay, everybody stop it. Everybody calm down. Hold on a second. So, let's just focus on a pure conversation. A pure and meaningful dialogue. A pure and meaningful connection. When you have that, you won't have any misunderstandings. And you have that by continuing on with the dialogue.
[00:15:21] Fawn: Yes. So if you stopped after, I don't know what you said to that man with the break a leg thing, but if it stopped right there, then it gets even worse. Cause that's where the story ends. But if you keep the story going, find something else. I tried.
[00:15:41] Fawn: I mean, who knows? He may be totally fine with it. You're, you're the one stuck in that situation. He 
[00:15:44] MATT: was my boss. I, yeah, blah, we still talked. We still, everything. So it was all right. But still, it was just like, dang. Did you 
[00:15:53] Fawn: ever discuss it with him 
[00:15:54] MATT: after that? No, no, never. Not 
[00:15:56] Fawn: even once. See, that's what, that's the problem you should have.
[00:15:58] Fawn: I probably should have. And that's the problem, right? We just get stuck and freeze and then we do nothing and it makes things worse. Yes. Point. When we have silence, it makes things way worse. Because our imaginations are so much louder than our words. Yes, and faster. On both sides. So, like, the person may think, he never spoke to me again.
[00:16:23] Fawn: He probably thought my performance was terrible, or, you know, like, he didn't want to bring it up again. Who knows what he's thinking? Right. So, that's why it's important, it's important to keep going. Move the story forward. That's it. Cute, short. I don't know if it was cute, you guys, but just a short message for today.
[00:16:41] Fawn: Another thing on the art of friendship. I hope that helps. I don't know what kind of art that was. Maybe that's a Jackson Pollock. I'm throwing out there some paint. Let me know what you think. We love you. Thank you so much for listening. Sorry about the short, short, short time here today. I'm just trying to gather our energy so we can do better shows.
[00:17:03] Fawn: That and also, I've been doing nothing but sitting and writing the past few months. Wish me luck. I'm meeting with some people to present my books. Hopefully my career will take off, you guys. Please, please send me some good thoughts. Anyway, thank you for listening. We love you. We'll talk to you in just a few days.
[00:17:21] Fawn: Be well. See you soon!