“Revisiting Friendship: Core Values, Disappointments, and Growth”

Core Values
Fawn: [00:00:00] Welcome back everybody. Hello. Hello. I think it's time to revisit some things. Full disclosure, I feel like, correct me if I'm wrong, Matt, but personally speaking, I've kind of stopped even wanting to have a bunch of friends because I've kind of given up a little bit. You know, you go through waves.
I'm, I'm going, I'm going through waves. I'm going through waves because I'm like, well, I am, very blessed and happy about my life right now. And at the same time there's a lot to be fearful about, and I'm like, are we going to move again? I, I don't know, like things seem up in the air, so I don't know.
It's a good time to revisit core values and friendships. But what I'm trying to say is at the same time, I've kind of been coasting because I haven't been, I haven't been in the mode [00:01:00] of really, uh, putting things out there in regards to friendship, because I have, you know, I have, I don't know, at least one person who's a friend. I feel safe, you know, like I feel good.
Mm-hmm. And I think you're blessed to have just one person that's your friend. but I think it's time to revisit what we want. It's revisiting what I want right now. So again, using myself as an example, I don't know if I'm making any sense to you guys out there, but what I'm trying to say is, let's revisit going down the list of what we want in life.
And speaking of friendship. You know how you make a list of things you want and when things happen in life that is not desirable, you're like, well, I definitely want something different from this.
Right? Yes. But it's a good opportunity. Esther Hicks talks about this, Abraham Abraham Hicks. It's considered contrast When you receive something that you don't want in life, [00:02:00] it's an opportunity for you to say, well, I want this. This happened.
No, I, I don't want this. I want this instead. Right, right. So what do you think your core values are? I think we have to visit that and realize what we want, What are deal breakers and stuff, what's your core value of what a friend is? Yes. For me it's non-judgment. , not looking down on me thinking that you're better than me.
 Being open to change, not disrespecting me. 
MATT: Right, 
Fawn: or my ideas or you know, no judgment, no disrespect, loyalty and honesty for sure. What are the core, what are some core values, do you think, besides 
MATT: those? Those are right. Those are right in with and 
Fawn: and, and I cheated because I asked you a few minutes ago.
I'm like, what are some values? 
MATT: What are the core values as identified? Actually, 
Fawn: do you mind going through them again? 
MATT: We [00:03:00] certainly can. I mean, loyalty is definitely in there. Respect and empathy are definitely in there honesty, definitely in there, of course. And there's a whole bunch of others which people view as important.
Shockingly, communication, trust, support, even shared interests, boundaries. 
Fawn: Those are yours though, right? No, 
MATT: these aren't mine. These are, these are lifted off the interwebs. 
Fawn: I don't necessarily like shared interest that much, I don't think, for me personally. Mm-hmm. I would prefer to have someone that has totally different interests.
It would be nice if we had a couple interests in common, but, and 
MATT: hence shared. 
Fawn: Yeah. But I, I would prefer if they had completely different interests, because that would open me up to things, you know, like I'm open to new experiences, depending. Right. But then that 
MATT: takes us right into growth, which is yet another one.
Mm-hmm. Welcome to. Right. 
Fawn: Okay. Go through them again. Go through them again.
MATT: Well. There's scads of them, but trust, respect, [00:04:00] empathy, communication, support, shared interests, honesty, boundaries, forgiveness, and growth. Those are, boom. That's list A. List B looks like dependable, loyal, listening, self-confident, humorous, and fun.
Fawn: What's the difference between list A and B? 
MATT: There really isn't one. They just happen to be from two different places. 
Uhhuh. Okay. 
Yeah. 
Fawn: Alright, so should we make a list of what we want? 
MATT: Well, for me it's like. Yeah, the, the kind of like, there's the base, which is all of them, and then there are some that are, you feel are more important than others.
And philosophers love doing this and putting things in groups and all the rest of it. But yeah, for me, I'm liking the honesty, the self-confidence, the humor, and the fun, because it seems like that's a lot of , the frictional points I'll have in friendships are because if somebody doesn't feel self-confident, then they're, they.
It's like poking fun [00:05:00] at 'em. You can, sometimes you poke the grizzly bear and sometimes you get bit, and I really like poking the grizzly bear, but I like it when you know, everybody's comfortable and confident in who they are and where they are. 
Fawn: I feel like I'm, I'm kind of. I have trepidation about mm-hmm
making a list because I feel like, okay, I made a list, and then when I'm in a situation, a thing happens, I'm like, oh, I don't like that. Right. You know, like, and it was on my list, or maybe it wasn't on my list. Mm-hmm. Either way, I feel like it's still,
 
it still, it still makes me go, Aw man. At some point, 
MATT: right? Yeah. And, but at some point it's like, I mean, you're right. You can make a list that's a book and ain't nobody gonna fit it. So , it's about keeping it reasonably small and figuring out what really are the quote unquote deal breakers.
Well, 
Fawn: even if it's, I'm not talking about necessarily fitting, but I'm [00:06:00] thinking about, oh, I didn't think about that. 
MATT: Oh point, yeah, 
Fawn: sure. I asked for honesty, but. What if they're brutally honest and mean about it? I didn't like, do you know what I'm saying? Like I maybe, like, am I not making things clear enough or if I make it too clear, it's just too much and I'd rather just live and find out Right.
When I do find out, I get, disappointed. 
MATT: Well, yeah, but then you pick up the eminently clinical boundaries. 
 You pick up the inimicable boundaries, which doesn't sound like a lot of fun. I'm not a huge fan of boundaries, but I realize they must exist. And so, you know, somebody can be brutally honest in telling you, wow, those shoes, oh my goodness. But they understand that, um, you know, perhaps you shouldn't get into it on capital punishment or
you know, my favorite sports team who just got kicked out of the playoffs or whatever, that, whatever that really sore spot would be. 
Fawn: I think my, one of my number one core values is [00:07:00] people who don't jump to conclusions. They don't come in with just their own experience and their own baggage and their own way of listening to you, but they're really listening to you with fresh ears.
Mm-hmm. So when I do say something or I explain something about my life, they don't just jump to conclusions where I have to go, oh wow they totally misunderstood me and no matter how I, how, how hard I try. Right they are now completely set on what they think they heard. It's impossible to change their minds.
You know what I'm saying? I do. Um, I don't know. I'm always surprised because people are always having their best behavior on until I think both, probably both people feel relaxed and then all of a sudden you run into a misunderstanding. Well, yeah, 
MATT: just, just between you and me, this is how I, this is the ugly truth that I'm holding onto.
Fawn: So what do we do? Because I still feel stuck. Yeah, I wanna make a list, but then look, this is what happens. What do [00:08:00] we do? 
MATT: Well, for me, I try to embody all the things that are on my list. 
Fawn: Yeah. But you're dealing with someone else. You are embodying it. Great. Good for you. Good for us.
I can 
MATT: only, I can only show you how to be my friend, but 
Fawn: I'm trying to avoid the disappointment here. Mm-hmm. What do we do? Just keep on going. 
MATT: Yes. 
Fawn: It's hard guys. It's hard. It's hard for me because like I'm thinking about one friend now and I'm like, I can't stop thinking about it. It's like I keep reliving things and you know, when you, I'm not saying it's the end of the friendship, but when you go through a friend breakup, you tend to relive certain things over and over again
mm-hmm to justify why you wanna leave. You know what I'm saying? So in my mind, I'm replaying all the things that this person said, 
MATT: right. 
Fawn: That I didn't respond to right away. [00:09:00] Because again, that pebble in your shoe that you think, oh, it'll just, I'll just keep walking. 'cause I don't wanna stop right now to take the shoe off to explore where the pebble is and take it out.
Mm-hmm. Because I, I need to keep walking here. Right. And so I don't say something right away. And if even if I do say it, then they fly off the handle. They completely get offended or, uh, very defensive. And then it, then we get into a realm of confrontation,
and when that happens, I just wanna back out and go, okay, you're right. Okay, bye. Do you know what I'm saying? Because I don't feel like arguing because I feel like I'm not being heard. Right? But that's just me personally. I don't know how you all out there feel about this? What do you think, Matt? 
MATT: Yeah. It's just like, I'm like an iceberg man. Like what I show is just a tiny little sliver above the surface, and as you get to know me better, you discover that there's a flipping like [00:10:00] iceberg underneath, or I go out of my way to express to you that there is an iceberg under the surface, so it all starts.
Fawn: That was my alarm to remind everything's okay. 
MATT: So it all starts with humor and we're just talking about. The latest blah in the news, or we're talking about sports team or we're talking about, you know, oh my God, what'd you do last weekend? Oh man, I went to the movies, whatever. It's whatever ridiculousness it is.
And then as you get to know me better, I. And you start to hear me express more of my stuff. But like, and you guys have heard me on the podcast when I talk about my music, I'm like, ain't nobody like my music. And that's because I'm very honest with myself about it. And so I know if I bring up my musical tastes, everybody's gonna like look to leave.
So that only works inside of a strictly humorous environment. 
Fawn: Do you think they look to leave? I don't think so. [00:11:00] Oh, thank 
MATT: God. Some of the music I listen to, 
Fawn: it's awesome. I love it. 
MATT: Well, you know the one song? 
Fawn: Yeah. It's my favorite. What are you thinking about? The anchor? Yes, the anchor. Oh my God, I love it.
The anchor. Oh, when we're upset there's this one song You guys wholely, completely inappropriate. Yes, but we'll blast it in the house and we'll yell, sing it, including the kids. This is when we have Let It Out Club and those of you who have been with our podcast know what that is. When we have Let It Out club, it's just things that we have to get out of our system that is only in our private home.
We can say whatever we want and nothing is held against you, but we'll sing this song. It's totally inappropriate, but it just feels so good by the time we're done. 
MATT: And it's, it's, it's pirate metal. 
Fawn: You just feel 
MATT: light. Which pirate metal. Just imagine a heavy metal soundtrack on top of Pirates of the Caribbean [00:12:00] and you're kind of 90% of the way there.
And this particular song kind of specifies what the pirate captain would like to do to this wizard who's bewitched him if he ever gets his hands on him. He's not an ice person. 
Fawn: Can I just go back to the iceberg thing? Uhhuh. Okay, great. You are an iceberg. I Why are you laughing? What if you're like me though?
I am not an iceberg. I'm a tropical island and you're in the water and you can see, perfectly clear what's under there, 
MATT: right? Yeah. I, I don't know. That's not, that's not my way. 
Fawn: Huh, well, what am I supposed to do? 
MATT: Well, wait a second. You mean to say in the first five minutes you meet somebody, you tell them, 
Fawn: no, but I don't hide anything.
MATT: No, you don't. And and in point of fact, I don't either. I'll answer certainly if somebody goes questing and querying and asking, well, then everybody's 
Fawn: like a iceberg then. But people, judge, people will assume what's under there. There people judge 
MATT: [00:13:00] quick. But that's just it. The music I listen to, oh my Lord.
I enjoy listening to it, but nobody, oh, you can go 
Fawn: again with the music, man. Hold on. 
MATT: Because that's an easy one. That's an easy one to throw out. Um, but nobody knows it. Nobody understands it. And yeah. And those are kind of the keys. And so if they're going to judge me on something that's, you know, easy, that's an easy one.
Fawn: Okay. 
MATT: But I'm honest about it. 
Fawn: But you know what, okay. My stuff is more complicated. Like, let's say, okay, I come from a certain culture. Mm-hmm. And then I have a friend who's exactly from the same culture. I am pretty much the same age, almost exactly. Like same, same, same, same way. Yet, totally different.
Totally. Like I feel judged, I feel, I guess I'm judging in a way too, or no, I'm recognizing I'm, I really, truly don't think I'm judging until I'm really mad at you, and then I have to bring up all the things on purpose. Like I have to [00:14:00] really think about all the things this person said that really hurt my feelings, that I kind of brushed away, brushed aside, but.
I don't know what I'm saying. I, I'm, I just feel like it's more complicated. For you, you say, okay, they're not into my music, but what if you are in the same music taste? And you still run into the conflict and you still run into the judgment somehow, you know, maybe they think their, their way of singing is better than yours, or they have a bigger collection than you, or they have been listening to it longer than you, or, well, awesome bully.
They're more advanced than you. No, because after a while it wears on me. It's like, enough, I've heard you say it. I feel like you're talking down to me now. 
MATT: And and there you go. And that's the thing. You're absolutely right. If somebody's gonna talk down to me. Yeah. No, forget about it. 
Fawn: So it's just, that's the end of the friendship.
MATT: Uh, it can be, I wanna say I have. It's, it's the [00:15:00] self-confidence, it's the self-respect, it's the, you know, inner Popeye. Ha ha. It's the inner Popeye of it. It's the, it's the being comfortable, I guess with, with where I'm at. 
Fawn: It's kind of like, if you think about business, it's kind of like having an investment.
You in a way you don't wanna stop investing because you've already invested for so long in this. So to bail out, you have a hard time just stopping it because you've invested so much time. Mm-hmm. Or so much effort. You've created so much. You've built something that you're like, well, I don't want to just lose it.
Right. It's an investment. Mm-hmm. But at some point you have to realize, okay, we have to move. You know what I'm saying? Like it's not. We're different now, or that my size doesn't suit this anymore, or it's not what I thought. That's okay. Yes. So it's okay to look for another house, or it's okay to look for another [00:16:00] place to live.
Mm-hmm. It's to say, okay, this friendship is not what I wanted. What I wanted was family. Okay. It's not. Came close, but let's keep moving. So becoming, detached enough from a particular way that you thought you were in association with this relationship, 
MATT: right. 
Fawn: With this friendship.
MATT: Yeah, I can see that. And 
Fawn: so moving on, 
MATT: and I've also gone through friendships where we have the same conversation over and over again, and when we hang out, it's exactly the same. 
Fawn: I can't do that. That drives me crazy. 
MATT: Exactly. And yet I can, 
Fawn: that is my biggest pet peeve. And I can, I cannot handle repetition like that.
I can, oh, it makes me angry. I 
MATT: can still figure out little tiny ways to push the conversations forward, but only little tiny Why? 
Fawn: Why do you even. Expose yourself to that. There's so much to do in life, Matt. Why sit there and have the same inane conversation? What [00:17:00] that is like a mental disorder to me. That is like you need to be.
In a, there, there's something really wrong there to think, okay, I'm gonna get together with this person. It's the same conversation. Did you not think that we had this talk again? Did you not remember, 
MATT: uh, see like what is 
Fawn: going on? 
MATT: That's outside of the scope of a, necessarily a friendship conversation, but yeah.
Fawn: I'm talking about friendship. I know, 
MATT: I know. And, and I was too. But now you're taking it into specifically the whole thing. Whereas for me, it was more of a, a vibe. Like the vibe is always exactly the same. The activities we would do would be exactly the same, and the conversations we had would be perilously similar.
Fawn: I have no patience for that. 
MATT: Right. 
Fawn: I can't, is it because I'm more of a person who. had the kind of upbringing where I had to constantly move maybe and be exposed to different cultures and you had such stability where everything was the same, that that's your [00:18:00] comfort level. My comfort level is change.
Like let's pack the bags, let's dear, go speak a different language now. You know what I'm saying? Right. And I was just saying an hour ago upstairs with the kids like, oh no, I think I've been, in one place long enough in like in one place, meaning like, I haven't traveled around mm-hmm. The world as much as I used to, or any travel at all, aside from moving that I feel like now I'm like kind of, I, I don't wanna use the word scared, but I'm uncomfortable moving because I'm like, oh no, how am I gonna deal with a completely different culture and language?
It's like becoming so comfortable with the temperature in bed and it's cold outside and you don't wanna get out of bed. It's that feeling, right? It's like, oh no, I wanna stay under the covers. But so much is happening. We can't live like that anymore. The world. Feels that way, right? That [00:19:00] you have to be comfortable with jumping in the cold water.
MATT: Well, you certainly have to keep yourself adaptable at all times. 
Fawn: Anyway, so that's all I have is just to think about what attributes do you want in a person that's in your life. I think becoming aware of that, of the attributes you do want mm-hmm. Will manifest it, hopefully, or
make it very clear when you meet people, what you're looking for. You don't have to say it to anyone, but just remember. So when you are seeing this person as they are, you're hearing them clearly that you are not feeling so hurt, that you're able to move through without, hardship. It's easy to go, okay, this person's really cool.
They're not my best friend. That's okay. These are not the attributes that I'm going to allow in my inner circle. Yes. At my core. In my core family. Right. 
MATT: Yeah. And I a hundred percent agree with that. I think most of the friendships I'm looking for are much [00:20:00] more superficial.
So hence fun and humor and honest. 
Fawn: See, I want that, but close. 
MATT: Right? 
Fawn: Not superficial. And, 
MATT: and that's just it to me, that's something that has to grow over time and through shared experiences and yeah, time , and exposure. So, 
Fawn: okay. Let us know what you think. Anything else to add? 
MATT: That's what I got. 
Fawn: That's what I got too mainly questions.
Um, let us know what you think. Have a beautiful every day. 
MATT: Be well. 
Fawn: See you soon.