"What Is Cool, Really?"

Fawn: [00:00:00] Welcome back to our Friendly World, everybody. 
MATT: Hello. When 
Fawn: was the first time you heard the word cool? 
MATT: I think my dad used it in conjunction with Groovy. 
Fawn: I think the first time I heard it was Happy Days,
MATT: it might've been via Charles Schultz and peanuts with, uh, Joe Kool, which was one of the Snoopy characters.
Fawn: We were at the museum a couple weeks ago, and I was looking at photographs of women from the 1940s, and I swear some of them look like now, but I'm like, is this a trick? They had this vibe about them that nowadays the Gen Z people have. I'm like, look at that. So it, it's like it's been there all along. You know that there's a certain suave, there's a certain, um, I don't know how to describe it.
What are the words to, there's a certain IT factor [00:01:00] that everyone has. Everyone has an it factor. It just really bothers me when certain industries think they know cool. And what bothers me is they only look at one way of cool. You know, I, I quit the photography industry, the art co, the art photography industry for this reason, because I just wanted to vomit every time I was faced with this, like these old, like cliche old
like art dealers or whoever they are that control everything. They're snooty, outdated, outmoded, disgusting, uh, what's the word I'm looking for? 
MATT: Sophomoric? 
Fawn: No. Um, just the way, uh, they put things down. What's the word for [00:02:00] that? Dismissive quality that they have really makes me feel outraged to the point where I, I, I quit that kind of photography.
I'm like, I hate you. I never used the word hate, but it just, it just made me feel like if I could have a sparring match with these people at the Dojo, I would be so happy. Matt, I would throw down like, you've never seen me throw down, but of course I would lose because I'm emotional about it. Right. But I just wish I could do, have a sparring session with these jerks.
I'm sorry. All these years later. See, I'm still charged about it. Yes. It's awful. I can feel it in my chest right now. What are we talking about? Okay, cool. So, so the other day it showed up in this beautiful industry that I love so much in the voiceover industry, ro and I [00:03:00] was like, are you serious right now?
I was reading a script in, in front of someone very big and. They asked me what script I was going for and I told them. They're like, oh, that's not for you. You're not cool. You are just not cool like that. And I was like, immediately, I almost, I mean, I started to spiral like within a split second down to the core of the earth.
Like all those feelings came up, you know, from photography. Mm-hmm. But also like, I'm not good enough. It's because I, um, she's seeing me on Zoom. She doesn't think I'm pretty, she, she thinks, what does she think of me now? Like, am I old now? I'm like this old person. I'm not fit enough for you or I'm not pretty enough.
And what, what are you thinking of me? Like, oh, oh, it's because I'm like racially like, you know, not attractive, you know, because I'm coming from this culture, like every thing, my God, that's all over the place. In a split second Matt. In a split second, I went there, but also in a [00:04:00] split second. 'cause I've been in so many different industries now.
In a split, in a split second, I could get myself out of it and maneuver my way. That's something that has come from experience. So in a split second, boom, I turned it around. I said, oh, ha ha. I laughed it off and I'm like, you know what is cool anyway? I mean, what do you, can you define cool for me? 
MATT: James Dean mean, and she 
Fawn: couldn't.
She couldn't. So she, well, no. She was pausing. She was pausing. So I took that pause and I said, please let me read the script. She's like, all right. I read the script. There was a pause. I'm like, here we go, whatever. She's like, and she said, I'm sorry. You are cool actually, but you are not the kind of cool, I thought. Do you know, I have to prove myself.
MATT: Oh dear. 
Fawn: But that again, like we were talking about this last week, but that first impression like, [00:05:00] is it really me that you're seeing? What are you seeing? Are you seeing me through a whole bunch of baggage, a bunch of lenses? Are we really showing up when we meet people? Are we really seeing with a clear view?
Are we, what do you think, Matt? 
MATT: I would, I would say yes, we are, except people are so vast. I mean, infinite isn't the right word because infinite is by definition crazy. But people are bigger than we give them credit for, and I think it almost hearkens back to the earliest days of, of when we heard about Cool.
Cool. Is Snoopy wearing dark sunglasses, man. Or cool is being able to dance really well or cool is that kind of aloofness to all of [00:06:00] society or is cool you know what is cool is cool like being like a master of a random thing, like a video game or, I mean, 
Fawn: nobody knows the answer and this is what keeps people from being friends.
I'm not cool like that. Or, or you are not cool like that. So for me, in a split second, it was an audition. But then really it could be about, you wanna become friends with this group, you don't think you're cool enough. Or maybe they think you are not cool enough, but no one knows what that means. 
MATT: Or, or maybe they think you're too cool.
It's, it's a weird dichotomy. I remember, oh my goodness. I remember, I thought I was, I was attracted to you. 
Fawn: Who? 
MATT: You? 
Fawn: Me? Yes. Oh, really? When you know 
MATT: that, 
Fawn: when, 
MATT: well, from that point until forever. What point was 
Fawn: that that you were attracted? When were you attracted to me? No, I wanna [00:07:00] know, because we're talking about this, so I walk in, I don't know how people see me, right?
But you are, you are. Oh my God. This is, by the way, she described me as a unicorn. But you are a unicorn. You are not normal. So I can't really ask you what, how you see me? 
MATT: Mm-hmm. Because I'm, do you know what I'm saying? Because you're not normal. No. 
Fawn: You see things that people don't see. Yes. You are like the ultimate samurai.
Can I, can I, can I get 
MATT: to my point though?
Fawn: Oh, sorry. Go ahead.
MATT: I remember, I was like, she's cute, and then I found out you had a belly button ring and I was like, oh. And if I was to phrase it in the context of the show, I would say, oh, she's too cool for me. But what I said in my day, when did you find out?
When we 
were sparring? Because 
no, 
Fawn: one of my things fell out. I think I saw it. 
MATT: I think I saw the belly button ring. Because you were wearing something Mat, something on a midriff. Like out to dinner. Dinner. It was dinner or something. 
Fawn: It was later, right? It was later. 
MATT: But anyways, I was like, [00:08:00] oh, this isn't gonna work.
She's, she's too, what did I say? Hardcore or intense for me, because I'm not a, I don't, nothing's pierced. Nothing's pierced. No tats. No piercings. I'm just, I'm just not cool like that. 
Fawn: So what changed your mind? 
MATT: So I got sad. 
Fawn: Did you really get sad? 
MATT: A little bit. 
Fawn: I. Was I there? I was there. Obviously. 
MATT: I saw your, I was, I was staring at the belly.
Fawn: Oh my flat abs back then before childbirth. 
MATT: Anyways, I, but that's just it. That that shows indeed, that showed my own kind of limitations and whatever, but we still managed to gravitate towards each other, which was a good thing. And I thought maybe I am cool enough.
Fawn: I miss my belly button ring. Hey, after the second kid, that was like not happening. It was just too, it was. 
MATT: But again, I think it's our own [00:09:00] limitations. Like one way to what is cool, what is, what is something that would be cool and honestly I think on some level, maybe over time I've outgrown that way of thinking that outmoded, there's one way to cool.
But I was still there in Aikido 
Fawn: right. 
MATT: And maybe not one way to cool, but like certainly certain groups wouldn't get along socially. 
Fawn: It just makes me so mad this whole topic of like, seriously, there's only one way of cool, and I see this on auditions all the time. They want someone cool. 
MATT: I. I'm like, Hey, what's up?
What?
Fawn: But, but I, I give it to my all. I'm like, okay, I'm giving you fawn cool. Right. Like, what? There you go. Hopefully you'll be inspired by this fawn. Cool. Right, Wendy. Cool. Matt. Cool. James, cool. Whatever. You know what I'm saying? Mm-hmm. Like, gosh. Like, [00:10:00] honestly, I say this, uh, I've said this so many times, but like all the actresses look the same ' cause they're cool.
One, one cool person shows up and then everyone else starts looking like them, speaking, like them physically manipulating their bodies like them. It's like, oh my God, really? But we still don't have a definition of cool. If I were to describe Cool, I would say it's someone that is confident and compassionate at the same time.
'cause they're super cool people that are just, just jerks because they don't care. They're so cool. Like the typical stereotypical cool, right? They're like, if we go back to school, the cool kids were kind of mean. Right? But then as time went on the cool kids were
nice and self-confident, self-assured, looking good, but very kind. That's cool. I don't know, that's my perspective, but what is it really? It is just having an understanding of the world and [00:11:00] your place in it. That is cool and is having a sense of leadership about you. What leadership means to me is someone who knows, who can see the landscape, but is so interested in what you are offering as well.
So we can work together. But is there to help, like is strong. That's cool. Someone who's able to see past whatever superficial garbage is floating around. Whatever stresses are out there, they're not going to become like a pigeon who like all of a sudden takes flight from one little noise. Right? Or a squirrel that freaks out over someone's sudden movement.
 Someone who can handle like is, is rooted, is grounded. And loving at the same time. I mean, to me that is the ultimate cool. And it comes in many packages in many ways, in many, many shades and stuff. It [00:12:00] comes in many ways. I'm done
MATT: not here to disagree with that at all to me cool. Is. What's the word for it? I mean, I wanna say there's a certain element of friendliness, yet aloofness. Like they're not here to shove an agenda down your throat, and they're not, typically, nobody is frankly one dimensional, so they're only gonna talk about this one thing. Cool to me is where I can just riff and they can just riff and we riff together. You know what I mean? So like. Take me off into left field. Well, let's go and I'll take you off into right field and let's go. But, but it's all blending together and there's a certain absence of ego, like I don't feel the need or desire even to control the conversation.
And that's really the sticky one and tricky one.
 
Fawn: Where does the [00:13:00] term too cool for school? What does that mean? 
MATT: It means, man, they can't tie me down with rules, man. 
Fawn: Really? Is that what that is. 
MATT: I think so, 
I'm too cool for school 
Fawn: And alright, so like if I were to take myself back to the Jerky, jerky Cool Kids in like middle school. I just walk up to them now, like, I think there's such a divide that happens with this whole concept of what cool is, this definition or this feeling of cool.
It's like, okay, living in LA I was always like mystified by how people don't cross certain streets. Honestly, like one neighborhood will never go into another neighborhood. What, like you would find very few people of color ever coming to the beach. They live right there. it's this invisible [00:14:00] boundary.
It's this invisible barrier that exists. And you know, that's a whole other topic for another day, but. Speaking of that, just this invisible boundary like I sensed and could, could feel the invisible boundary in middle school with the cool kids, right? But these cool kids were jerks, they were racist, they were awful, but they were the cool kids and they were different, different tribes of them.
Like there were the rich, cool kids with lots of money, rich. Always in designer outfits. Ooh. And the teachers loved them. It was disgusting, you know? Then there were the kids who like hated all Middle Eastern people and like they were more like into music and like they were more ratty looking, but they were the cool kids.
But like, ugh. Okay. So. If I'm me now going back to that time in that body, like in that body being, [00:15:00] being like me that age back then, but with my sensibilities now, I, I think I could easily get through that barrier. By just going up to them and saying, hi, how, how you doing? Guaranteed every single person has a problem.
And I knew that. And I knew in class, I would be sitting, you'd be sitting next to these kids and you would hear, you would overhear their conversations about problems at home or whatever they were going through. They were just normal human problems, 
MATT: right? 
Fawn: If you go up and offer some kind of humanity.
Usually not all of them. Some, some of the jerks no! but like honestly, it's that human connection is the cool factor that can get through any kind of boundary and develop a friendship
 And kind of widen that tribe. You know what I'm saying? 
MATT: Mm-hmm. I do. 
Fawn: But is that me hopeful thinking. Wishful thinking. I 
MATT: don't actually think that's the case. I don't, I don't think you're having wishful thinking at all. I mean, for me, [00:16:00] I didn't really think about cool elementary school. No. Even middle school, I didn't think about it.
And we didn't have people with designer outfits. At least not that I paid attention to. And maybe that was just my own thing or whatever, but it, it was like high school was just. Only way to be cool was to listen to the music. I listened to. Bam. One Dimensional Ferociously one dimensional. And I can remember there was one guy in one of my classes, I borrowed an album from him I remember tripping out because he didn't look like he should enjoy the music, but he did. It made me rewrite a little bit, just a little, and then in college I didn't hang out with anybody who listened to my music and now I'm quote unquote adult.
I still don't. It's like my music as a defining element of cool and or my tribe and, and or the rest of it. It could be. I mean, I'm certainly, I'm, I certainly, if I ran into somebody who actually listened to the stuff I'd listened to, we'd probably have a really good time [00:17:00] talking about it. But it's deeper now and, and the friendships I make and the conversations I have with people, they center around everything.
 It would be so limiting for me to define it in that one dimension again, but it was so important to me at that point. 
Fawn: Look, it's the same as. Okay, guys, full disclosure. The family, we've all been watching different kinds of, um, um, matchmaking dating shows. Oh, dear. Matchmaking shows, right? Oh, not me.
I would never, I mean, and first remember we started, before our podcast came along, we were a matchmaking service for platonic friendships. So it's clear the whole family is into matchmaking, right? But we've been looking at different matchmaking shows and it's just mind blowing certain groups of people.
It's kind of not kind of, it's completely embarrassing watching yes, [00:18:00] these people, because they're so superficial and so shallow, and they're looking for true love and marriage, but yet all they want is someone with exactly blonde hair, blue eyes, perfect body, yet they're ugly. On the inside and I'm sorry on the outside if you're gonna have that kind of criteria, you are not pretty.
Do you know what I'm saying? Like that guy, you know who I'm talking about, Matt? I do. I do. Not attractive. How dare you. But they all do that. Not all, but like on this one particular show we were watching, like every single person was so superficial. Even the matchmaker, we expected more, but even the matchmaker was like not asking proper questions.
You know, like, and it goes back to being cool. It is superficial. I think true cool is deep. Deep. You have to go deep. 
MATT: [00:19:00] Yes. And wide ranging and 
Fawn: that, and that's how people become cool because they, they know something. It's like the great comedians, right? Like we love Kat Williams. Kat Williams sees the most absurd stuff and it's stuff that, you know, we kind of like ignore, but once he points it out, we're like, we're laughing because it's true, right?
MATT: Yes. 
Fawn: Because we all see it, but we don't see it. We ignore it. We're unconscious to it. But he's cool because he can pick up on that. That's what I was saying before, like you kind of, you, you ride away above that, that kind of subculture thing that everyone is like so bogged down with, they're able to elevate past that.
That is cool. Anyway, I said I was done, but that was it. Now I'm really done. Okay. 
MATT: Okay. Do you have 
Fawn: anything else to add? 
MATT: Nope. Not a word. Not a wit. 
Fawn: Be cool guys. Love you. Please reach out to us if you need us anytime we're [00:20:00] here. See you in a few days. Be well. Have a beautiful every day.