What To Do When Your Friends Break Up

When Friends Break-Up
[00:00:00] MATT: What happened now? Hold on. Wait. Whoa, whoa. Okay. I've got the whole, I've got the details. 
[00:00:06] FAWN: You've got the gossip, but there's 
[00:00:07] MATT: stuff. Didn't you say gossip is no untangle. 
[00:00:11] FAWN: Hi everybody. Hello. So what do you do when your friends break up with one another? Do they actually break up whatever? There's something going on.
[00:00:20] FAWN: There's strife, there's breakage. 
[00:00:21] MATT: What happened, especially when you've. Both friends who are in the process of breaking up at like exactly the same time. 
[00:00:30] FAWN: What do you do when your friend group, the others break up? They haven't broken up with you, but you're kind of left in the dust. I, I feel like I've been left in the dust.
[00:00:41] FAWN: Like what hap, what do I do? Who do I talk to? Who do I not? Am I not supposed to talk to someone? What's happening exactly. Also because now I, I, I feel like, I mean, what happened? 
[00:00:59] MATT: Well, for starters, you know, we can almost go back to the day we literally met, um, you know, this particular group and like literally the first thing person A said was, oh my God, that Matt and Fawn, they talked talk too much,
[00:01:14] MATT: which is a little harsh. 
[00:01:18] FAWN: Oh, you think it's harsh? I mean, you're always telling me I talk too much, 
[00:01:23] MATT: but I do it with love. 
[00:01:24] FAWN: No, you don't.
[00:01:28] FAWN: Well, this is, this is one of the big no-nos for me is when people say you talk too much, because usually people don't say that to men. True. So when I hear it, it makes me feel something. Right? Like angry? 
[00:01:45] MATT: Yes. 
[00:01:45] FAWN: ANGRIFIED because of what? You don't wanna hear the woman talk like what? I'm not supposed to speak. Okay, go 
[00:01:51] MATT: ahead.
[00:01:52] MATT: Well, yes, but in this particular context it was, he was feeling very possessive of this other person and feeling possessive, he wants to monopolize the , attention of the other party and well, we, we glanced in and, you know, my talkative self. I'm like, you know, I, I'm talking a mile a minute.
[00:02:11] FAWN: So we took the attention away from the friendship, their friendship, because we came in, right? And then I guess we took attention away from, how do I say this? What, 
[00:02:22] MATT: when, when you add friends into a friend group, it changes the dynamics. 
[00:02:26] FAWN: Person B didn't like that person A was talking to us more.
[00:02:30] FAWN: Right. Or talking to us right at all. Yes. Because they enjoyed their one-on-one time. They enjoyed their one-on-one time with our person A, right. A and B were always chit-chatting. And then they met us and we're like, hello. We came in and talked too much. 
[00:02:45] MATT: Well, we changed the dynamics of the group and this is a scary thing for people.
[00:02:49] MATT: you get very comfortable, inside of whatever patterns you're in and when those patterns start to change, most people have a nasty habit of trying to clinging to the old ways. there's a reason why it took blockbuster video forever to finally realize, hey, maybe streaming is something.
[00:03:05] MATT: Because they had a system that had worked for them for years and they didn't realize that the world had 
[00:03:11] MATT: changed. 
[00:03:11] FAWN: I think it also comes down to an issue of self-esteem, or self understanding. It happened with our kids. When our kids were little, they finally made some friends, you know, they weren't the greatest, these other friends.
[00:03:25] FAWN: I gotta say now that I have hindsight, right? But Little Elle was so upset when it was a whole bunch of other kids and the attention she had from this one supposed friend was given to other kids. Mm-hmm. it was at a time where we really needed one-on-one time because we were going through so much.
[00:03:48] FAWN: Right. The kids were going through so much that I think when that attention from that friend was taken and placed on other people and not all on Elle it's heartbreaking. It's heartbreaking when your friend pays attention to other people when you need them most. It hurts. It hurts a lot. And I think when you get to a place where you can be good with yourself, right, it doesn't hurt.
[00:04:17] FAWN: But sometimes when you really need someone and the attention from that person is no longer there temporarily, but you need it right at that moment, it is a terrible feeling. Terrible feeling. Yes. 
[00:04:31] MATT: Yes. Needs Absolutely. They are, absolutely Overwhelming. Absolutely. That's why I don't know. I, I tend to see friendships as being more like cake in the banquet of life.
[00:04:44] MATT: They're not, they're not the main course. They're this, they're this lovely thing. 
[00:04:49] FAWN: They're, 
[00:04:50] FAWN: they're not the main course. Why are you laughing? 
[00:04:55] MATT: Because we do a whole podcast on friendship, and I just said, it's not the main course. Wait, 
[00:04:58] FAWN: I 
[00:04:59] FAWN: think it's the main course. 
[00:04:59] MATT: See, for me, it's, it's the relation I have, I have a few relationships that are the main course and they are friendships, and these are friendships I've had for a very, very, very, very long time.
[00:05:11] MATT: But, you know, when I meet people, I don't automatically put them into positions of, I was about to say authority. It's not authority, but positions of. Ah, what's the word? I can't even think. Central positions in, in my world, I very much see them as a nice to have. I treasure these nice to haves. I, I, you ask anybody, I likes me my dessert.
[00:05:38] MATT: But, I don't kind of put my own kind of emotions, my feelings, you know, they're not dependent on. And I think that that's a little unique. I think, the fact that I can do this is one of these like bizarre, wonderful, weird things, and it takes a very long time for you to transition into a much more central place for me, right?
[00:06:01] MATT: But this is not the case in this particular relationship. 
[00:06:04] MATT: So what 
[00:06:05] FAWN: happened was, so our friends, it seems like they broke up and we don't know what to do what do you do, Matt? 
[00:06:13] MATT: Right. And, and I've, God, I'm like at a ringside seat for this whole debacle. Because, because they 
[00:06:21] FAWN: both told you exactly what happened.
[00:06:23] FAWN: Exactly their perspectives. And neither one is, exaggerated. It's exactly 
[00:06:28] MATT: what happened. I believe it is fairly accurate, 
[00:06:31] FAWN: but it's interesting. Then I was left outta the loop, like, I have no idea what's going on. 
[00:06:36] MATT: Well, you don't go hang out with us as often. Because it's an early morning thing. 
[00:06:42] FAWN: Okay, so what, what's, 
[00:06:44] MATT: what's, so what is going on is, 
[00:06:49] MATT: So one of our friends is very acerbic and very, what does that mean? Blunt? And see, there's a word I want to use, but unfortunately Well, he's 
[00:06:59] FAWN: very gruff. 
[00:07:00] MATT: He's gruff. Yes. Acerbic means kind of gruff and acid like, and 
[00:07:05] FAWN: um, like you, you have to have a thick skin to be around him sometimes. Yes. You can't get offended because he'll offend you.
[00:07:12] FAWN: Yes. 
[00:07:13] MATT: Immediately. But he also has this endearing charm of, he doesn't hold anything back when he offers you something. It's his whole heart he offers. 
[00:07:24] FAWN: Yeah, he's totally, I mean, he is his truth. It's all out there. He just, he doesn't hide anything. Not a wit, but you have to watch out.
[00:07:33] FAWN: The things that sometimes get thrown at you from him are not rose petals 
[00:07:38] MATT: and they can hurt. They can sting. Okay. So basically he told our other friend, you talk too much 
[00:07:47] FAWN: a woman. 
[00:07:48] FAWN: Yes. And he knew that that was an issue, right? Yes. That's an issue. An issue. we've talked about that many times.
[00:07:56] FAWN: How being told that at work, being told that as a woman, being told that in your life you talk too much, it's highly inappropriate. Especially to say to a woman, 
[00:08:08] MATT: right, ex. Exactly. It's a deal breaker. And, and she, she kept saying that she's heard him say this to her before. 
[00:08:16] FAWN: Yeah, but she didn't she say this is a deal breaker.
[00:08:19] FAWN: Like, 
[00:08:20] MATT: and now, now she's absolutely saying that. Now she's going. Everybody has their own journeys. Everybody's on their own journeys. Everybody is, progressing towards or away from something. And she is starting to again, get back into her own power. And she is centering and she is transforming majesticly in a very good way.
[00:08:45] FAWN: And she has a lovely voice by the way. She's wonderful to listen to 
[00:08:50] MATT: and she is a great conversationalist. She 
[00:08:52] FAWN: really is. She's a great listener, very compassionate, and 
[00:08:56] MATT: talk to anybody about anything. She definitely, for any length of time, 
[00:09:00] FAWN: is not a person you want to quiet. No, she's, her voice is important, right?
[00:09:06] FAWN: Everybody's voice is important. Yes. But her voice especially. It's interesting though, because she's the one who pointed out, People about our podcast have been saying that they wish you spoke more. And then I took that as like, I talk too much and it hurt my feelings. Right? Do you know what I'm saying?
[00:09:25] FAWN: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Absolutely. This actually, this bit of information actually came from her, ironically. Right? It's interesting when someone goes through struggles like that, that they may be the ones that actually give you that same message. So if her struggle is you talk too much. Then that was her message to me.
[00:09:45] FAWN: Not directly, but she's like, you know, it's interesting. I've heard people say about your podcast that you talk too much or they wanna hear message, they wanna hear me 
[00:09:55] MATT: more. Well, that's not my fault. I don't think that that means you talk too much. 
[00:09:59] FAWN: Um, to me that's what I hear. But it's also not my fault that you don't talk.
[00:10:03] FAWN: Right. But again, you're, but you also always blame me, Matt, because I don't let you speak and I know I just cut you. But so what? Yes. You hold your ground. You're a big man now and again. 
[00:10:19] MATT: Anyways. Um, yeah. Uh, I honestly think that she just wishes I would talk more on the podcast. Not that you talk too 
[00:10:27] FAWN: much.
[00:10:27] FAWN: Whatever. That's my issue. Let's, let's get back to, 
[00:10:29] MATT: to them. Exactly. So back to them. it's literally like, well, that's my last nerve, so, you know. That's fine. Whatever you wanna do is whatever you wanna do, but here we 
[00:10:41] FAWN: are. No, tell me what you said. You said she, didn't she say something like, alright.
[00:10:49] FAWN: You're definitely gonna hear a lot less from me. Yes, that is true. Tell me what she said. That was brilliant actually. What'd she say? Did she actually say it? She 
[00:10:57] MATT: actually said that, yes. 
[00:10:58] FAWN: Tell me. Tell me what she said. Well, what you just said. No, because you used different words like, I don't remember 
[00:11:04] MATT: exactly.
[00:11:04] MATT: I'd have to start, go, go through. So scrolling through 
[00:11:07] FAWN: texts. Oh my God. So she basically said, oh, I talk too much. All right then I will not speak, you won't hear from me. Bye. 
[00:11:16] MATT: Right. Ouch. Right? I mean, that's a pretty slick burn, frankly. 
[00:11:23] FAWN: Is it a burn though? It's the truth. I mean, it is the truth of she gave plenty of notice, that's what happened with me and my friendship.
[00:11:30] FAWN: Breakups. I give them notice. Oh, especially when I love the, the people notice after notice after notice. And if they constantly ignore me, Right. Ignore what I'm saying. Then it's a deal breaker. Then I leave, I disappear. I don't just leave right. Disappear. You will never hear from me again. That's how I play. I know.
[00:11:53] FAWN: It's terrible. 
[00:11:54] MATT: It is what it is. And, and honestly, what she was saying was, connection is a big thing and if the way I engage with you isn't appreciated then you can suck it. She said that. Yep. Hopefully that'll sneak through the, the sensors on the podcast. And also she said, , I've been his friend for too long to waste any more energy on this.
[00:12:24] MATT: Wow. So this has been coming and this is fair warning to everyone out there, just because as a computer program, Computer will do the same thing every time I ask it to do something, unless it's chat, g p t, which is a whole other thing. But computers have a nasty habit of doing exactly the same thing over and over again.
[00:12:43] MATT: People don't, people have a nasty habit of not doing the same things over and over again. So just because it was okay at moment A to say something very hurtful to somebody doesn't mean it's okay in moment B or C or D. And so that's FairWarning to people out there. 
[00:13:04] FAWN: When is it ever okay.
[00:13:05] MATT: I 
[00:13:05] MATT: know it's never
[00:13:06] MATT: okay. I know, I know. Okay, 
[00:13:09] FAWN: so 
[00:13:09] MATT: what do we do? So what are we, so here we are. We're caught in the middle. 
[00:13:14] FAWN: Are we though? No, not really. Well, I mean, you are you? I guess I'm completely out. Oh, I have no idea. You 
[00:13:20] MATT: know what? Inner Popeye. Inner Popeye time and really thinking about it, you know, I am gonna go through and I'm not gonna pretend or not pretend that I'm not talking to one or the other, and I'm not going to pretend if I am, if I'm with one and I see the other, I'm not gonna ignore them.
[00:13:39] MATT: That's ridiculous. And you know, If they choose not to engage with one another, then they choose not to engage with one another. And that's fine, but I'm not going to allow them to hold me in place and not engage. 
[00:13:55] FAWN: That's cool. But if one of them has a problem with that, then we have a problem. This happened to me with those yoga bitches, right?
[00:14:01] FAWN: Because one, one group of the B I T C H E S is I, I specifically told them. What was bothering me. And they, they thought, they understood. They understood, but they kept ignoring what I was saying. Mm-hmm. And so one day something else happened in the yoga studio and I told them what happened. These are the friends that usually had my back.
[00:14:27] FAWN: Right, right. And I told them, and they were just like, all of a sudden I could tell that whatever fir they didn't agree with me, It was totally my experience. I was experiencing major racism, major, like I was just being gaslit by Right the yoga owner, of the school. And they didn't wanna hear it anymore.
[00:14:51] FAWN: Of course not. Because they wanted to go to that school. They wanted to be friends with these people. Right. And I said, that's fine. You do you, that's fine with me. Mm-hmm. But know that I'm really upset and hurt and so are my, so are my kids. So the next time we went to class, this was a few hours later, we were visibly upset because the last straw was just too much for me
[00:15:14] FAWN: right. Dealing with this yoga teacher. And so we were visibly upset and they took that, even though I had just told them hours ago, I'm really, I'm really beyond upset now. Mm-hmm. And this is why, because of the, the teacher now did this. Once again, they ignored me and then they took it personally because we were upset, so visibly shaken during yoga class, when I got home, there were all these messages on my voicemail saying, how dare you?
[00:15:47] FAWN: You don't know how to be a friend. How dare you treat us like that. I didn't treat them anyway. They knew I was upset. I told them specifically I was upset. So when they saw me in class I just looked at them and I was just quiet. I was pushing back tears and I went home, you know, and they just took that personally, and so that led into this big, from my perspective, they misunderstood because they didn't listen, but because of the vile messages that they left on my, my voicemail.
[00:16:21] FAWN: There was no going back, um, because of the words that they used, because of the right, the venom, the way they talked to me. I was like, whoa. And ironically enough, they talked to their own family like that, so they treated us like family, and that was a deal breaker for me. You don't talk to me like that because there's no going back.
[00:16:40] FAWN: There are certain words, there are certain things that you can say that will completely forever change the relationship. And for me, that was a deal breaker. So I never spoke to them again. And then there was another friend who was caught in between this. I told this friend exactly what was up, and I said, look, I'm fine with you being friends with them, but I'm gonna let you know the pain is so strong for me,
[00:17:08] FAWN: then if you are hanging out with them, then I can't hang out with you because it's it's too painful for me. Right. And I don't see a separation and I need separation right now. Mm-hmm. And she's like, I understand. Next thing I know, They're going to our, the place that we were gonna move to, they went to Italy together.
[00:17:29] FAWN: They took a big trip overseas together. And they're texting me, or she's texting me. The one that was caught in the middle. She's texting me, like, first of all, she didn't even tell me she was going. I like, somehow found out, but that was like even more painful. And so that let me know I can't be friends with you.
[00:17:48] FAWN: I, I'm gonna cut you off too. The way they were like, look at us. We're having so much fun. Look Fawn you belong here. It's like, I know I belong there. I'm the one who told you about that town. I'm the one who said We're moving there. Do you know what I'm saying? So I do. And then later on I found out, oh my God, this, now this, the person in the middle is now talking behind our back and supposedly not understanding why I'm not speaking to her anymore.
[00:18:17] FAWN: Where I specifically told her I'm not. I'm not okay with you guys hanging out if you still wanna hang out with me. I just, I don't know. There needs, there needs to be some communication. You can't just, it just can't be the way you want it. Like you have to understand that it's hurting me deeply. Right, right.
[00:18:39] FAWN: And so she ignored that. I had an hour long conversation face to face with her to explain this. Again, it was ignored, just like how the others ignored. So I'm like, okay, that's it. Bye. Like, I never, they never heard from me again, but I heard from other people, like, she doesn't understand. She's so hurt. Why are you doing this to her?
[00:19:02] FAWN: You, you're crazy. They start calling me crazy. Nice. Because, Uh, because no one was hearing my pain and why I'm not, why I'm choosing not to hang out with them. Do you understand what I'm saying? 
[00:19:16] MATT: Yeah. And this, am I clear? This is all a lot of the kind of basic re one of the basic reasons why we do what we do.
[00:19:23] MATT: Who us in particular? 
[00:19:24] FAWN: Yes. On the podcast, what do we do? Oh, the Art of Friendship. 
[00:19:27] MATT: The art of friendship. Art of communication. I mean, pay, you know, literally you can, you can sum up a lot of painful lessons I've learned by remembering to pay attention and to listen to what is 
[00:19:39] MATT: said 
[00:19:40] FAWN: and
[00:19:40] FAWN: take people seriously, believe them, what they're telling you.
[00:19:45] MATT: People always 
tell 
[00:19:45] FAWN: you who they are, 
[00:19:46] FAWN: but they're also telling you what they need. Yes. You know, like the other B I T C H eses.
[00:19:55] FAWN: Am I spelling that right, by the way? Es. Right. I think so. So like I kept saying you guys going out to coffee is costing me 300, $350 a month, which I don't have. I can't keep going out for coffee. Can we please do something else? Nope. They, they didn't care, right? Like I asked them for several months.
[00:20:17] FAWN: Several months, and I still went out for coffee. I still struggling and you know, it that, and that's just one example. Mm-hmm. But they didn't hear me. They don't care 
[00:20:30] MATT: so, and there you go. They don't care. I mean that, that sums up a lot of that 
[00:20:35] MATT: relationship. 
[00:20:36] FAWN: Yeah. But then when you 
[00:20:38] FAWN: get quiet or like bow out and step aside, then they start talking all kinds of stuff about 
[00:20:44] MATT: it.
[00:20:44] MATT: Well, because it's a personal affront because people believe by and large that they are moral, kind and a million other really positive words. And it's hard on people when they get a mirror shown up to them to show them exactly how they're not kind, how they're not, uh, giving, how they're not good friends.
[00:21:05] FAWN: But I don't think this is the case with our friends here who we're talking about. They're both very mature 
[00:21:12] MATT: and this is just, they both, somebody just tired of someone else's 
[00:21:16] FAWN: stuff and they both get it. Like I. Friend B gets friend A being upset about being told that she talks too much. Yes. He knows exactly what he did.
[00:21:29] FAWN: Yep. There's no hiding it. There's no misunderstanding. It's just, it's actually quite adult from my perspective. Yes, very much so. It's not like trying to have someone take any side or anything like that is just a natural progression, I guess, or a natural state of things. Yes. Without venom. There's no venom.
[00:21:51] FAWN: It's just, it is what it 
[00:21:52] MATT: is. I think there's still venom. I mean, I, I definitely see both sides, like hiding from, you know, putting themselves in a place where they'll see the 
[00:22:01] FAWN: other, well, this just happened recently, right? 
[00:22:04] MATT: Well, yeah. This is only like a week or two old. Yeah. 
[00:22:07] FAWN: Well, you need some time. You 
[00:22:09] MATT: do need time for sure.
[00:22:11] MATT: But you know, I, I think that that will continue for a minute and longer than you think I would think, I think one of them will alter their patterns completely so they don't run into the other. Huh. But when friends break up, I mean, honestly, it's tricky when you break up with a friend, when a friend breaks up with you and when, two friends that you're friends with, have have their breakups;
[00:22:35] MATT: it's just a sticky situation. And honestly for me, I have it in my. Where I stand kind of playing through all the variables. Like if somebody says, if you're friends with them, you can't be friends with me. Okay. I know what I'm gonna do. It's, it's pretty simple. 
[00:22:51] FAWN: You do? I do. In this case. 
[00:22:53] MATT: You do? I do.
[00:22:54] MATT: Okay. You know, and I made that decision very early and it's not a trivial Decision, and it's not a decision to be made in haste. You know, you definitely wanna take the opportunity to ponder, ponder the terrible things, unfortunately. 
[00:23:08] FAWN: But it's not like you're not gonna be friends with the other one.
[00:23:11] FAWN: You're just going to tr tread lightly. What are you gonna 
[00:23:15] MATT: do? I'm just gonna be careful, but I'm not gonna, I'm gonna be honest and open. Mm-hmm. Completely. Right? And I think, I think that is going to be the raw strength behind it. And so if one asks me the question of, you know, so have you seen so and so lately?
[00:23:32] MATT: I'm gonna be honest and tell 
[00:23:33] FAWN: the truth, but what if they don't ask you? Like I didn't ask, Hey, did you go to Italy or are you thinking of going to Italy? Because I had no idea, right? This was my place to Absolutely. And I'm, you know what I'm saying? Mm-hmm. So are you do, my question is, will you just be saying, Hey, I'm gonna go hang out with person.
[00:23:56] FAWN: Person, this 
[00:23:57] MATT: person. I'm not gonna change the way I communicate with either party. Okay. 
[00:24:01] FAWN: Period. My question is, will you communicate when you're going to be hanging out with the other person to the other person? I'm gonna hang out with this person. I'm 
[00:24:11] MATT: not gonna avoid it, but I'm not gonna bring it up either.
[00:24:14] MATT: Okay, so if it comes up, if we talk about something, I think the other person will be interested in. I'll bring it up. And the whole kit and caboodle. 
[00:24:22] FAWN: Are you going to tell them? That this is how you, your course of action is. Yes. That I will, I just don't want you to end up like the person in the middle, in the yoga group 
[00:24:32] MATT: that I will, and I, I've already spoken to party B 
[00:24:36] FAWN: Oh my God.
[00:24:37] FAWN: Too many, too many points I've already let came to Algebra 
[00:24:39] MATT: Earn no. Okay. Where I'm standing and I will let him know where I'm standing when I talk to him next. Okay. That's good. It's all gonna be That's good. Very transparent, very out in the open. If somebody has a problem with it, then we'll have to figure out what that means or doesn't mean.
[00:24:54] FAWN: Right. Okay. So, 
[00:24:57] MATT: alright. Right. But yeah, there's, there's no skulking, there's no hiding, there's no lying, there's no just be out there. Just be honest. And you know, you can make an unpopular choice if that's what you wanna do. Just make sure that you ponder it, you play through the angles.
[00:25:13] MATT: You, you know, whatever else you need to do. 
[00:25:16] FAWN: Okay? So, is that it? 
[00:25:20] MATT: When friends break up, just try and be there. 
[00:25:24] FAWN: Where?
[00:25:26] MATT: Wherever you feel honestly 
[00:25:29] MATT: honest and comfortable being. 
[00:25:32] FAWN: But you have to communicate where you're at. Like I said, don't be the middle yoga person cuz I never wanna talk to that person again either.
[00:25:42] FAWN: I completely 
[00:25:42] MATT: understand. Yes. Transparency is good. Yeah. Just 
[00:25:46] FAWN: communication. There you go. And not having a charge on anything, 
[00:25:52] MATT: right? Yeah, you well, you definitely. You definitely wanna try and stay out of, you know, their particular fight unless you know, obviously you feel the exact same way as one side and then you've picked your side.
[00:26:05] FAWN: See, I kind of disagree because when you are too neutral, there's no way anyone can be totally neutral. You know, like I feel like in my case with the other friendship I was describing that I broke off. Mm-hmm. They were getting too neutral, but they weren't neutral cuz I could sense that they didn't wanna be neutral anymore.
[00:26:29] FAWN: Right? They didn't care how racist or how unjustified things were. They didn't care. All right? Yet they were telling me they wanna be neutral. 
[00:26:41] MATT: Right? But that's somebody attempting to keep the moral high ground. What does that mean? What do you mean That's what being quote unquote Switzerland is. Which by the way, there is no moral high ground in Switzerland.
[00:26:53] MATT: That's a whole other story. Didn't they 
[00:26:55] FAWN: keep all the bank accounts in gold of the concentration camp? Mm-hmm. Victims? 
[00:27:01] MATT: Yes, and, and they manage to get a fair number of Nazis bank accounts too. Thank you. Well, I'm assuming, but anyways, they were not neutral. I'm what? But what I'm saying is, you know, they, they put a face on being neutral.
[00:27:13] MATT: They didn't, they weren't actually neutral. If, if you're actually gonna be neutral, actually be neutral. If you're actually gonna side on one side, then for the love of God let them know. Don't lie about it. 
[00:27:23] FAWN: Let 'em know. Don't lie cuz omitting it is lying. Oh 
[00:27:27] MATT: yeah. Big time. That, learn that in Sunday school 
[00:27:29] FAWN: omission is lying.
[00:27:30] MATT: Comission Omission baby, though. That's how people lie. Co mission. That's by actually doing or saying something. Really? Yeah. 
[00:27:37] FAWN: Never heard that one before. Well, that word 
[00:27:39] MATT: should have been in Sunday school. No, 
[00:27:41] FAWN: thank you.
[00:27:41] MATT: So, okay. 
[00:27:43] FAWN: Okay. 
[00:27:44] MATT: Got it. Got it. Okay. 
[00:27:46] FAWN: So love is winning. I don't know right now. Love is winning. Love is always winning. Okay. Even though I'm really perturbed, it's still winning, I guess. Okay. Alright, so, so take away. Take away. Be honest. 
[00:28:02] MATT: Be open. That's kind of pithy. 
[00:28:06] FAWN: It is, isn't it? Be open. How 
[00:28:10] MATT: know?
[00:28:12] MATT: Know yourself. Know your feeling. And, and have a clear understanding of, of how you would, how you will proceed. I think, and don't, and be transparent, don't lie. I 
[00:28:22] FAWN: think my advice is to be grounded, grounded in the earth, like super, anchored and stable. Therefore, you don't fly off the handle with any kind of situation.
[00:28:41] FAWN: Or someone say saying this and that. You don't just like get flighty, stay grounded in your love for people and stay grounded in truth and calm. And I think that will help things to have a steady, a steady person, a steady, very, um, not rocking person. Do, I don't know the word for. You just steady, calm and steady guys.
[00:29:12] FAWN: Anchored, grounded. Okay? All right. All right. All right. Talk to you in a few days. Love 
[00:29:18] MATT: you. Hopefully she still loves me. Folks, 
[00:29:22] FAWN: take care out there and love you. Take care out there. Take care, love you, talk to us. Reach out to us, our friendly world podcast.com. Alright, be well see soon.